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wright
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OK, let's try this again.
The Lyme's bacterium can invade any system of the body, including the nervous system (as I'm sure you know, because of your "extensive research"). If that is the case, then the bacterium can very well affect any part of the nervous system, including the central nervous system, which houses the lower motor neurons and the peripheral nervous system, which contains the peripheral nerves. If that is the case (and it is), then Lyme's disease can very well cause muscle atrophy . . . and that muscle atrophy can be symmetrical or asymmetrical, depending on where the bacterium has decided to invade.
Furthermore, if Lyme's disease is a condition that can mimick ALS, then why is it so hard for you to understand that weakness, muscle atrophy, twitching, etc. can be symptoms of Lyme's disease (don't answer that, it's a rhetorical question . . . I already know the answer)?
Then we move-on to the rest of your enlightened post. Once again, you make no mention of weakness in your hands, even though you have muscle atrophy. Not possible with ALS. On top of that, being weaker on one side of the body is completely normal. I have been an avid weight lifter for longer than you have been on this planet, and I still have a more dominant side when it comes to strength. Then the best line of them all: You believe you can reverse ALS if you catch it early enough. That doesn't even merit a response and truly shows how little you know.
You are another person who has chosen to go on the internet to "educate" themselves without first having a background to do so. You are not the first we have seen (unfortunately we see tons of you) and you won't be the last. You also won't be the last to mysteriously disappear, as they all do. It just amazes me that people think they can truly understand ALS, just because they can spell ALS . . . and by the looks of things . . . that is the only thing you understand about ALS.
This is what I'm going to do tomorrow:
I am going to announce to all of the medical students that I teach that they have wasted their time going to college for 4 years . . . have wasted their time working their butts off to get fantastic grades to get into medical school . . . that the 4 additional years they will spend in medical school (once again, working their butts off) will also be a complete waste of time . . . that their residency (of 3 to 8 more additional years) will be a complete waste of time as well. They will undoubtedly look at me completely mystified until of course I tell them that all you need to do is search the internet, and all of the reliable information will allow you to be a physician. If they still don't believe me, all I will need to do is show them your enlightened posts and there will then be a collective "oh" and they will all get up and leave and be on their merry way, to being fantastic physicians as you now are. Just so you know, you are going to cost me my job, because then there won't be any more medical students for me teach.
Do you want to know why I'm being so sarcastic? It's because of the misinformation you are spreading . . . it's because of your uneducated speculation . . . it's because you think you're smarter than physicians who are treating you (believe me, you are not) . . . it's because you are polluting this forum and subsequently the internet with your rhetoric. I will not stand for it and neither will a lot of people on here. If you want to ask questions, then ask questions. If you want to self-diagnose yourself, then self diagnose yourself with any disease your little heart desires. If you want to do the other aforementioned things, it isn't going to happen here.
The Lyme's bacterium can invade any system of the body, including the nervous system (as I'm sure you know, because of your "extensive research"). If that is the case, then the bacterium can very well affect any part of the nervous system, including the central nervous system, which houses the lower motor neurons and the peripheral nervous system, which contains the peripheral nerves. If that is the case (and it is), then Lyme's disease can very well cause muscle atrophy . . . and that muscle atrophy can be symmetrical or asymmetrical, depending on where the bacterium has decided to invade.
Furthermore, if Lyme's disease is a condition that can mimick ALS, then why is it so hard for you to understand that weakness, muscle atrophy, twitching, etc. can be symptoms of Lyme's disease (don't answer that, it's a rhetorical question . . . I already know the answer)?
Then we move-on to the rest of your enlightened post. Once again, you make no mention of weakness in your hands, even though you have muscle atrophy. Not possible with ALS. On top of that, being weaker on one side of the body is completely normal. I have been an avid weight lifter for longer than you have been on this planet, and I still have a more dominant side when it comes to strength. Then the best line of them all: You believe you can reverse ALS if you catch it early enough. That doesn't even merit a response and truly shows how little you know.
You are another person who has chosen to go on the internet to "educate" themselves without first having a background to do so. You are not the first we have seen (unfortunately we see tons of you) and you won't be the last. You also won't be the last to mysteriously disappear, as they all do. It just amazes me that people think they can truly understand ALS, just because they can spell ALS . . . and by the looks of things . . . that is the only thing you understand about ALS.
This is what I'm going to do tomorrow:
I am going to announce to all of the medical students that I teach that they have wasted their time going to college for 4 years . . . have wasted their time working their butts off to get fantastic grades to get into medical school . . . that the 4 additional years they will spend in medical school (once again, working their butts off) will also be a complete waste of time . . . that their residency (of 3 to 8 more additional years) will be a complete waste of time as well. They will undoubtedly look at me completely mystified until of course I tell them that all you need to do is search the internet, and all of the reliable information will allow you to be a physician. If they still don't believe me, all I will need to do is show them your enlightened posts and there will then be a collective "oh" and they will all get up and leave and be on their merry way, to being fantastic physicians as you now are. Just so you know, you are going to cost me my job, because then there won't be any more medical students for me teach.
Do you want to know why I'm being so sarcastic? It's because of the misinformation you are spreading . . . it's because of your uneducated speculation . . . it's because you think you're smarter than physicians who are treating you (believe me, you are not) . . . it's because you are polluting this forum and subsequently the internet with your rhetoric. I will not stand for it and neither will a lot of people on here. If you want to ask questions, then ask questions. If you want to self-diagnose yourself, then self diagnose yourself with any disease your little heart desires. If you want to do the other aforementioned things, it isn't going to happen here.
BeautifulWreck
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wright
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BeautifulWreck
The difference between your posts and the posts of Bellaxo are night and day. You came here to simply ask questions. She came here to spread misinformation, which will cause unneeded panic to those on here and those who will eventually come here. That is why you have been treated kindly and why she has received the reaction she has.
There are those on here that feel some of my posts and other's posts are a bit cruel at times but part of it is a bit of tough love and part of it is a refusal for misinformation to be disseminated on the forum.
The difference between your posts and the posts of Bellaxo are night and day. You came here to simply ask questions. She came here to spread misinformation, which will cause unneeded panic to those on here and those who will eventually come here. That is why you have been treated kindly and why she has received the reaction she has.
There are those on here that feel some of my posts and other's posts are a bit cruel at times but part of it is a bit of tough love and part of it is a refusal for misinformation to be disseminated on the forum.
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Gusflower
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I really believe in what Wright says is true about how Lyme can cause atrophy anywhere if it arrives in your brain.
I have not been diagnosed with ALS, but I have a bad feeling of where it is going. It is not that I want it to be true it is just that it probably is. After having taking the antibiotics nothing has improved for me. It has gotten worse actually. Swallowing, breathing, atrophy in the lips. I still keep on taking it all though. I want my health back and there is only one thing that I know has happened to me and that is the tick bite. Over the years it is possible, and this is a theory of ALS, that it is caused by bacteria. But in that case it is still in 99% cases irreversible, and especially for those with bulbar symptoms.
I have not been diagnosed with ALS, but I have a bad feeling of where it is going. It is not that I want it to be true it is just that it probably is. After having taking the antibiotics nothing has improved for me. It has gotten worse actually. Swallowing, breathing, atrophy in the lips. I still keep on taking it all though. I want my health back and there is only one thing that I know has happened to me and that is the tick bite. Over the years it is possible, and this is a theory of ALS, that it is caused by bacteria. But in that case it is still in 99% cases irreversible, and especially for those with bulbar symptoms.
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bellaxo
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Gusflower if the underlying cause to your symptoms is Lymes it can be reversible. How long were you on antibiotics and what were they? Specific protocols are used in situations like yours and people have improved. IV Ceftriaxone paired with Metronidazole and sometimes an additional Macrolide antibiotic might make all the difference in the world for you. If you tested positive for Lymes these are medications you should be on regardless. If you were put on a tetracycline there is no doubt in my mind that you have continued to decline, as this group of antibiotics has been known to actually hasten ALS. I don't know how long you were taking antibiotics but I have to stress with Chronic Lymes presenting with ALS CNS symptoms, Long term therapy is IMPERATIVE. 2 or 3 Months of treatment is simply not enough time. Those who have improved the most have been on antibiotic therapy for many months, some even years - but guess what it saved their life. Before someone else attacks me claiming I'm spreading misinformation I want to make it clear this is only in reference to a POSITIVE Lyme diagnosis. My insurance like many does not condone the treatment of Lymes after the typical 30 days, so unfortunately I've got an expensive road ahead of me but there is no doubt in my mind that if anything is going to work for me, it's going to be that protocol.
bellaxo
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By the way I posted an extensive follow up to my initial claims with references and citing many publishing's supporting my statements. However it seems this forum prevented that post from appearing.... Very strange but whatever - I'm not retyping everything.
trfogey
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I don't think Bellaxo came here deliberately to spread misinformation, Wright. She's been reading the Lyme literate sites and finds them credible, because she didn't have anything to challenge them and not enough worldly experience to realize that doctors who won't take (and can't get) insurance reimbursement are probably doing something shady. And like most folks her age, when what she believed was challenged, she snapped her mind shut and became defensive.
Now she's in "prove me wrong" mode. I'm willing to cut her some slack just so we can get the refutations to the bad information on the table. We can't do much for her until she opens her mind again and starts listening instead of jousting for her "side", but future seekers here might be less doctrinaire about Lyme "literacy" and get something from this discussion. Maybe even Gusflower.
Yep. Not enough of that in the past for this board has definitely left a trail of craziness in the Google archives. Oh, well, live and learn.
wright
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Ah, the little girl responds.
All of the references and arguments you bring up have been debated on this forum ad nauseam and I'm certainly not going to waste oxygen bringing them up again. You're really good at "research" so go find them for yourself.
There is absolutely no definitive evidence as to the cause of ALS. There are many theories but none proven. That is why I don't speculate like a FOOL about what might cause it and then cause people to read said FOOLISH speculation and then panic.
Do I know that the Lyme's bacterium doesn't trigger ALS? Nope, and it must be proven that it does before you convince me and it must be proven before I state such a thing. That is science . . . proof . . . unrefutable proof. I know science . . . you clearly don't. I have more published papers in peer reviewed journals than you have teeth in your mouth, so spare me your diatribe about science . . . you amateur.
Oh, and good luck on your quest in proving you have ALS. You're a dime a dozen around here. I'm sure the more you "research" it, the closer you will get. Amazing, coming from someone that doesn't even know what type of physician would diagnose ALS. That was a very telling question you asked.
P.S. In reference to Lyme's and muscle atrophy:
Lyme's is known to cause a number of motor neuropathies, including mononeuritis multiplex. Someone on this very forum got that from Lyme's and believe it or not, it didn't develop into ALS. Oh, by the way, motor neuropathies cause muscle weakness and muscle atrophy. I bet you didn't know that. Do one of your cute little internet searches to "educate" yourself about those conditions, so you can become an expert in yet another field.
All of the references and arguments you bring up have been debated on this forum ad nauseam and I'm certainly not going to waste oxygen bringing them up again. You're really good at "research" so go find them for yourself.
There is absolutely no definitive evidence as to the cause of ALS. There are many theories but none proven. That is why I don't speculate like a FOOL about what might cause it and then cause people to read said FOOLISH speculation and then panic.
Do I know that the Lyme's bacterium doesn't trigger ALS? Nope, and it must be proven that it does before you convince me and it must be proven before I state such a thing. That is science . . . proof . . . unrefutable proof. I know science . . . you clearly don't. I have more published papers in peer reviewed journals than you have teeth in your mouth, so spare me your diatribe about science . . . you amateur.
Oh, and good luck on your quest in proving you have ALS. You're a dime a dozen around here. I'm sure the more you "research" it, the closer you will get. Amazing, coming from someone that doesn't even know what type of physician would diagnose ALS. That was a very telling question you asked.
P.S. In reference to Lyme's and muscle atrophy:
Lyme's is known to cause a number of motor neuropathies, including mononeuritis multiplex. Someone on this very forum got that from Lyme's and believe it or not, it didn't develop into ALS. Oh, by the way, motor neuropathies cause muscle weakness and muscle atrophy. I bet you didn't know that. Do one of your cute little internet searches to "educate" yourself about those conditions, so you can become an expert in yet another field.
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bellaxo
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Wright, did attempt to prove it by posting links to numerous case studies. Apparently the moderators on this board didn't think it was "acceptable" therefore I am restricted to proving you wrong. Whatever dude I'm not here to argue or debate, that's not what this is about. I won't be returning - peace.
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