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Wow Jim, that sounds like a horror story. I admire you for having the perseverance to overcome the obstacles the chair has presented.

My wife is pretty small, and I don't think there is any way she could push me and the wheelchair to maneuver in tight quarters like you do.

I find that with my chair, I can maneuver unassisted in tight quarters. It is a very large chair, so there is a physical limit to how tight of quarters I can maneuver in, but manually pushing it would not make any difference.

I did have the programming modified on my chair to allow maximum torque at all speed settings. That made quite a difference in slow delicate movements on hills (such as getting into and out of the van's easylock when it is parked on a hill).

An interesting observation about my front wheel drive chair is that the chair is physically shorter when going backwards. That is because the rear caster wheels rotate around. When space is really tight, I have to go backwards. The entrance into my house requires me to do this. After a couple of tries, I found it to be no problem at all.

Steve
 
i think it like what jim said. i must been in to rc's to long. to me every car i built an raced you had to work with it. i didn't get to pick my chair. i was just lucky to get one. they took my size and that was it.
 
I so appreciate your comments! I am also impressed with your adaptation, Jim, but on the other hand, its sad! None of us should have to "make due" with these tools that are suppose to support and enhance our lives! I have a variety of folks that drive my conversion van, so I need to be able to get up/down the ramp by myself, independently. So if I follow Diane's advise and complain in writing and verbally and get a refund on the chair - what the h*ll do I get instead? How do I know what to ask for as a replacement?
 
I have a Permobile M300. It also has some caster wheel jerk since it has 8" caster wheels. What I found best when changing directions (forward or reverse) is to move sideways initially so you give the caster wheels a definite direction to change. I often look at the caster wheels first so I know what side to go. Also make sure if you go through a doorway you can get all the way through. It is really hard to change directions part way through.

I go to an MDA/ALS clinic and everyone I have seen uses Permobil so I went with that brand. Other than a couple of small problems it has been excellent. It is amazingly powerful. I have gone up some real steep slopes with no problem.
 
The problem is the mid wheel drive so get a rear wheel drive. Manufacturers seem to be really promoting the mid wheel drive, to the point of reducing the number of rear wheel drives in their product line. They seem to think that the ability to sit and spin in a tight circle is more important that being able to drive and stop in a straight, non-jerking line! Quantum does make a rear wheel drive, the Rival, and it drives fine, but in order to have tilt and recline, the mechanism takes up space on the back of the seat. Mounting a BiPAP or vent then makes the chair several inches longer. Permobil has the C350 rear wheel drive which I now have and really like. Stephen Hawking has the C350 too, and I think it really means something that two long time power chair users chose a Permobil rear wheel drive!
 
I've had my Quickie QM-710 for over two years now. It's performed fine.
 
Diane, you really know your PWC! You'll have to tell the story of how/why you are so knowledgeable about so many different models!

If a Permobil C300 is THE chair for Steven H., thats enough of an endorsement for me!

To add to my story - my able bodied husband help me with van practice today. To my credit, I am happy to report that I was able to get the chair up and down the ramp successfully - once. However, he tried it multiple times, trying to gain experience to instruct me. But one time while on the ramp coming up, the casters went "flooey". He tried to let off on the joy stick - however the chair still propelled forward and the joystick caught the corner of the van, knocked the joystick to the side of the chair, then bent the movable arm before it finally stopped. All of which kicked up my startle response, but I was able to fight against the EL. This is not a chair for sick people....have I mentioned that before? But, in all fairness, I do really appreciate the tight turning ability this chair has. But if I have to choose between tight turns and getting out of the house and into the van, I choose the latter.

Deb
 
Whoops......thats C350, not C300.
 
My chair is a Permobil C500 VS. If it were to somehow disappear, I would purchase another one. I like it a lot.

I am also looking for a backup chair. A Permobil C350 or another C500 are at the top of my list.

Why am I looking for a backup chair? These wheelchairs are complex things, and complex things will fail. I have had 3 failures in 4 months of very active use (almost 500 miles on the chair):

1. A seal failed in the left drive gearbox, requiring a replacement motor and gearbox assembly. This was replaced under warranty. Research and conversations with repair folks reveal this to be a very rare thing (fortunately).
2. A switch failed leaving the wheelchair in the standing position. I was able to download instructions to bypass the switch using the rnet controller (no mechanical work needed). The switch was out of adjustment and was fixed in less than an hour at the wheelchair place. This was also a warranty repair. Research and conversations with repair folks reveal this to be a somewhat common thing, but easily fixed.
3. The charger failed. I was provided a loaner charger of a different brand that also failed. The second loaner charger has worked fine. The final replacement is in the mail to me. This was also a warranty repair. Research and conversations with repair folks reveal this to be a pretty common thing. I have decided to purchase another charger so that I have a backup.

I am kind to my chair, but use it hard. I do not in any way abuse it. I regularly take it up the gondola at the ski area where I live and do a 5 mile dirt-road descent of about 2,000 ft vertical. I also regularly take in on a paved bike path with 1,000 ft elevation gain over 4.5 miles (9 mile round trip). I put over 10 miles on the chair on a surprising number of days. I have occasionally put 20 miles on the chair in a day (with a long mid day recharge).

I have also worn out the drive and caster tires on my chair and a replacement set is on order (working on getting the insurance paperwork in place). I look forward to all the fun I will have wearing out the next set of tires:)

Steve
 
If turning radius is not a consideration, rear-wheel drive is certainly worth a look. But as counterpoint, I will list a few situations in which turning radius/depth was the difference between being able to be somewhere and not. If these don't apply to you, you have more reason to consider RWD.

  • Getting on city buses, light rail, streetcars, monorail
  • Wheeling up to restaurant tables
  • Parallel parking with the lift in bed transfers
  • Getting into tight spaces in movie theatres and concert halls
  • Getting into elevators
Each of these required angled movement and moving the joystick before moving the chair.
 
Igelb is certainly right that turning on a dime is really helpful in getting into tight spaces where a tight turn is needed, but I have never been prevented from getting into any of these places in a rear wheel drive chair. But my mid-wheel chair jerked so badly that getting into any of the places mentioned meant repeated lurching and smashing and bashing back and forth to get at least close to where I needed to be. That is as good as making a place inaccessible in my mind! Getting hung up on uneven ground was really annoying too. There are no doubt some mid-wheel drive chairs out there where that lurch is only a little, tolerable jerk, but jerking is normal in mid-wheels. I would never buy a mid-wheel drive without a thorough test drive at home that includes tight spaces and being able to easily control precisely where the chair stops as well as a jaunt out doors.
 
My (already mentioned) QM-710 is a mid wheel, and I have not encountered this lurching.
No issues going into or out of my van.
 
I agree, Diane, w/ any chair you need to drive it before signing on, in some of the tight situations it will be in. And in the situations I listed, trial and error in lining up the chair was definitely necessary, many times.

In our case with a small apt (with angled hallways and rooms), and in a completely urban, always crowded environment, sheer size was more important than for many of you.
 
swalker; (with a long mid day recharge).[/QUOTE said:
Is that for you or the chair, Steve? :wink:
 
Both;)

I do have bad news to report though. When I was coming down the mountain today, my wheelchair suddenly started behaving wildly. It would unpredictably make a left turn. It had very little power when turning right.

I experimented with it quite a bit and am convinced it is a real (and potentially dangerous) problem.

I suspect that one of the control modules (specifically, the ESP module) has failed or had a bad connection.

It looks like I will be spending the day tomorrow driving to Denver to get it looked at.

Steve
 
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