Concerned that my symptoms are early ALS.

kws

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Nov 23, 2024
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5
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Learn about ALS
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State
MI
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Paw Paw
I am a 58 year old male, type 2 diabetic who has always been very physically active. Muscle cramps and fasiculations in lower legs about 8 months ago. I initially thought these were due to hard physical labor in warm weather. Cramps were increasing in number and disrupting sleep. I took Trulicity from 2022-2023 and noted weight and muscle loss. Was seen by PCP 10/24 where I was told that my fasciculations looked like ALS. Panic set in..... I have also experienced continued muscle loss and muscle fatigue/weakness on both sides. Since early October, I have completed brain and spine MRI which are both normal. Blood work has been negative for other neurodegenerative disease so far. EMG done at local hospital which was normal and repeated at U Chicago ALS clinic which was also normal. It was recommended that it be repeated in 2 months. The fasiculation's have spread to my arms and abdomen. My muscle fatigue and muscle tingling have continued to progress. I know my blood sugars were poorly managed for about 6 months following stopping Trulicity but my endocrinologist does not think that my symptoms are from a diabetic neuropathy. The persistent muscle weakness/fatigue and fasciculation's spreading along with uniform muscle mass still has me believing I have some neurodegenerative disease process. Does this sound familiar to anyone? I would very much appreciate any insight or thoughts.
 
Hello, I would like to thank anyone taking the time to read this. I am sorry I did not see the link "read before posting" when I posted my brief synopsis of my recent history and current health concern. Although I have had some sense of hope after reading the post I am still left with no answer to my progressing problem. My strength is slowly fading and I continue to have muscle loss. Here is an example. I am building my own home and I needed to drill holes through my concrete walls using a wet core hole saw. This is not an easy task in the best of conditions however I have done this many times in my life. working on my knees I ran the drill for about 20 minutes my legs were really stressed, and I had trouble completing the cut with my arm strength alone. I stopped to take a break. When I stood and tried to walk I struggled to walk. I felt like my muscles in my thighs were so spent they would not respond smoothly. I kept trying to walk and they slowly improved. I was able to continue on for another couple hours after which my legs were really fatigued but needed an additional person to help me apply the pressure needed to complete the cuts. I could walk but with difficulty. This was on Thursday. Friday and Saturday I felt very sore muscle aches mainly in my legs. I feel a bit better today however, not at all fully recovered. Six months ago this would not have caused anything more than an evening of mild fatigue and a little soreness the next morning.
My fasciculations are frequent and more pronounced in my abdomen. I have them in both my upper and lower legs and my arms. I feel fatigue and weakness in my legs the most but somewhat in my arms, symmetric in both.
I have read the EMG report and I was incorrect in calling the results "normal". My Neurologist told me I had signs of carpel tunnel in my right wrist. I'm not sure if the other things mentioned have meaning I do not understand
here is the summary

SUMMARY OF FINDINGS: Skin temperature was maintained at >= 32 ºC. Normal sensory responses of the right sural nerve Normal sensory responses of the right radial and ulnar nerves. Abnormal sensory response of the right median nerve with prolonged onset latency, decreased amplitude and slow conduction velocity. Normal motor response of the right peroneal and tibial nerves Normal motor response of the right ulnar nerve Abnormal motor response of the right median nerve with prolonged latency, normal amplitude and borderline normal conduction velocity. Normal motor response of the right ulnar nerve after 10 seconds of exercise without >100% increment (LEMS screen). Normal F wave responses of the right tibial and median nerves. 3 Hz repetitive nerve stimulation of right ulnar nerve-ADM does not show 10% decrement; RNS was of adequate quality. Abnormal needle electromyography of the bilateral lower extremities, right upper extremity as tabulated below. CONCLUSION: This is an abnormal study. There is electrodiagnostic evidence of a moderate-severe right-sided median mononeuropathy at the wrist (I.e. carpal tunnel syndrome) There is electrodiagnostic evidence of fasciculations, primarily in right gastrocnemius. No electrodiagnostic evidence of neurogenic reinnervation in the right L3-S1, left L5-S1 and right C5-T1 myotomes at this time. No definitive electrodiagnostic evidence of a pre-synaptic neuromuscular junction disorder.

One question I have is this
when muscles die from ALS do you feel the fatigue and soreness as they get weaker or do they just turn off as it seems some people report ?
I have not lost any function at this point other than when I overexerted the muscles in my legs and they would not work normally for a time.
 
Your EMG points away from ALS. I would question any doctor who said, "fasciculations look like ALS." That is a very reckless statement.

Muscles don't die from ALS. Motor neurons die so signals that move the muscles are no longer there. Sometimes you just feel weaker or have less ability because there are still other muscles compensating for the one not receiving the signal to move. Other times, you can suddenly get foot drop or inability to do something.

I would follow the instructions from your neurologist as far as further testing and don't be afraid to ask what differentials are on the table.

The drilling may have caused the carpel tunnel issue. Work with your doctors.
 
Thank you for taking your time to respond to my post. I have been having the fasciculations which have progressed from below the knees to arms and abdomen over the last 8 to 9 months. My feeling weakness in my legs has slowly progressed over around the last 6 months. it seems to me to be a slow but steady decline in strength and stamina. I agree that my EMG results offer hope. I will continue to see my Neurologist and try to determine what is causing these problems.

I thank you and all the contributors to this ALS forum as those of us who are just learning about this disease and fearing for their health are in need of information from unbiased people with knowledge on the subject.

if you would allow me one more question ? I am stuck on the question as to wether an EMG will definitively show damage if a persons significant change weakness/ strength and fasciculations are caused by ALS ? If this is the case than my problem seems likely to be something else.
Again, Thank You and I wish you a very good new year !
KWS
 
Fasciculations that are from ALS are lower motor signs which should show on emg. Generally speaking so is clinical weakness. That can be upper motor neuron but when it is there should be strong umn signs on clinical exam. If your exam and emg are normal / not suspicious for ALS then your answer is elsewhere
 
Thank you Nikki my best wishes to you.
 
Good Morning, I have just returned from a visit to Mayo Clinic to see a neurologist to get a second opinion on my condition. Would you be willing to look at these test results and give me your opinion ?
I believe my strength is slowly fading. My muscle mass is slowly shrinking, mainly in both legs and I have fasciculations lower legs and lower abdomen primarily however I see very slight ones in hands and arms. They have spread from lower legs only 4-6 months ago
My physical exam was normal however he mentioned my reflexes in my ankles were more brisk than he expected in relation to my other reflexes. all my other reflexes were 2/2 my ankles were 0/0 on the doctors notes.
my CK test level was 86
I also had a change in my CBC. bloodwork showed my Hemoglobin 17.3, Hematocrit 49.7,and Erythrocytes 5.93 All three are out of range High ?
My Emg was different than the previous results ? I cannot meet with the Doctor until the end of January to go over the results
The Differentials he listed were ALS, Chronic Fatigue, or another Myopathy


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Brisk reflexes would not be charted as 0/0 but anyway it sounds like your exam was unworrying. Your emg interpretation clearly states it is not an ALS EMG. It is not uncommon to find evidence of old injuries especially in a person over 50 though we see it in the young too

Your doctor listed als and myopathy as differentials before or after seeing the emg? Neither are supported by that emg
 
Since your issues are troubling you, I would ask about PT, which could help reduce the effects of the old injuries you seem to have.
 
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