Old 02-17-2014, 02:59 PM #1 (permalink)
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Default Atrophy

Please can someone explain to me what atrophy is like when it begins. I have a "dent" in my inner knee/lower quad area, it hurts when I push it and I don't have one on my right side. My left thigh is tight and sore. Any opinions/ advice welcome, thank you.
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Old 02-17-2014, 03:15 PM #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Dents are not atrophy. There is an excellent sticky about dents on aboutbfs dot com. Please look there and read it. Did you see the neuro yet? I know you were waiting for an appointment. If you have any atrophy they will see it. I had a neuro GLANCE at my leg and say there is obvious atrophy. I did not see it myself nor can I see it now. Please stop worrying about ALS
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Old 02-17-2014, 03:45 PM #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Thanks for replying Nikki. Yes I saw a neuro who did a clinical exam, I'm not aware that he took any notice of my legs ( I mean atrophy) , I had my jeans on so he didn't see the dent. He said I didn't need EMG and to go back if there are any changes. I read on here someone had " dents " that we're strophy? I'm concerned really as it's quite a mix of symptoms, twitching, soreness, tightness etc. thanks again x
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Old 02-17-2014, 04:04 PM #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

The 'dent' you may have read about maybe the dent that occurs between the thumb and first finger and on the same location on the palm. I'm not sure of this but in Australia, Neuros there believe it's an early sign of ALS. I have been diagnosis with PLS but I have developed that dent on my left hand and palm so take it with a grain of salt... as they say.
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Old 02-17-2014, 04:24 PM #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Thanks for reply Clearwater AL, I don't know much about atrophy, especially in thigh/knee area, not sure what it feels like. My "dent" is sore, soft and sqidgey. My whole left thigh is also sore after using it for very little.
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Old 02-17-2014, 08:32 PM #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

You might like to Google "split hand syndrome".
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Old 02-17-2014, 08:48 PM #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Here is a pic of my hand. I was di Ag nosed in September. But I have had symptoms for over two years. My hands link dramatically different now. I've always had the bony wrist bump, legacy from my dad. I can still write, but forget pinching, zippers (unless they have extra ribbon or rings), and buttons.

My feet are starting to look a bit different. I can't walk on my heels, or tiptoes. I can only tap beats with my right.

The only pain I have is bruises from falls, or my tail bone which has some muscle lose in that area.

Be sure to read all the stickies on this forum. They help so much. Feel free to message me if you have questions. I am still learning many things from this wonderful group of people.

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Old 02-18-2014, 12:23 AM #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Thanks both for the response, texastracy your nail varnish is lovely! Obviously my concern is the area around my knee, I'm not sure if it's possible to atrophy there first ? Does weakness come before or after? Thanks again x
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Old 02-18-2014, 11:37 AM #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

The dent above your knee sounds like it is in the vastus medialis. This muscle has a pronounced bulge in bodybuilders and athletes with good powerful legs. It sounds like this is the area showing your dent. There are exercises you can do to build up this part of the muscle if it is just a muscle /exercise problem.
Atrophy is the wasting away and shrinking of the muscle. In my case, my left calf atrophied. There was no pain and I didn't even notice it until I lost the ability to do calf raises or stand on my toes on either foot. At that point the atrophy was visible and my PCP measured the loss at 1 inch.
As to the hand dents, TexasTracy's pictures shows pronounced atrophy in the FDI (First Dorsal Interosseus).

Tracy, do you also have significant atrophy in the APB (Abductor Pollicis Brevis) which is the muscle on the base of the thumb that joins the palm. That also leaves a "dent" that, I believe, ClearwaterAl, Mediasmart and I all share. Atrophy of the FDI and APB are being viewed as possible sign of the Split Hand which researchers in Australia, India and Canada (at least) are viewing as a definite sign of ALS (and almost no other disorders).
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Old 02-18-2014, 02:05 PM #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Thanks dusty7, we'll mine definitely goes in not out. Any ideas re the muscle soreness? I'm guessing it's in the vastus laterals? Thanks again
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Old 02-18-2014, 02:29 PM #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

From-- Vastus Lateralis & Muscle Strain | LIVESTRONG.COM
"The vastus lateralis is one of four muscles that make up the quadriceps. These muscles work together to extend the knee. The vastus lateralis is located above the knee joint, toward the outer edge of the leg. It lies beneath the iliotibial tract, which is a band of fascia that runs vertically along the outer thigh. The vastus lateralis is susceptible to muscle fiber tearing -- which is called a muscle strain -- through knee extension in sports and everyday activities."
It's possible you injured your quads (which includes the vastus lateralis and vastus medialis) by overworking them, but that would only be a guess... and a long way from the subject of this forum.
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Old 02-18-2014, 04:36 PM #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Yes you are right, I've previously read that information, it just seems strange I've been having the soreness for so long. Thanks for the help though, I take on board what everyone says. X
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Old 02-20-2014, 02:45 AM #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

I've had the chronic soreness in my left thigh for months now, it definitely gets worse the more I do. Am I right in thinking muscle soreness ( in my case left thigh ) isn't typical ALS onset? Thanks for your help all. X
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Old 02-20-2014, 11:20 AM #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Atrophy

Saying the same as usual to avoid confusion, I am not a doctor, just a med student.

A lot of people have dents around the spot you describe, it is subcutaneous fat breakdown from having your legs crossed a lot over the years while sitting down. If its most pronounced when knee is in flexion, that makes this explanation more possible.

My son got sore knee joints when he was doing a lot of martial arts, he got an ultrasound and it proved to be fluid that had leaked out from the discs. His dent was also squishy at touch. He had also slightly torn a ligament in approximately the same spot.
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